What was the issue and did you take your money back?

 

The issue had to do with firearms transfers. That's not why I would give them a negative review though. It's their business and they can run it how they see fit. The problem isn't my inquiry about transfers for members. It's how they handled it. If they want to enact whatever policies they think customers will accept fine. How rude they were to a paying member however was not fine.

I didn't take the refund. I never asked for one and never intended too. I joined the range to shoot. The free transfers they advertise for members was simply something I saw as an added benefit of the membership. Can I get $300 worth of shooting out my yearly membership? Absolutely. Free or not will I use them for transfers? No, I'd rather pay someone else. I don't care to have any more interaction with them from this point forward than necessary. Would I recommend them to anyone after today? Absolutely not.

 

Hopefully you were more clear with your issue to them than you were to us.

 

@makeutap247 none of us know what your talking about. If you are going to post a negative review on a range or dealer, particularly a well known CSC sponsor, please share what the "issue" is. Negative reviews on CSC need to have basis and issues stated. Simply saying you don't like them and they are wrong without details isn't how we like this to work in the review section when it comes to a negative review.

Thanks.

 

Hopefully you were more clear with your issue to them than you were to us.

Again, the basis of my negative review would be how rude, unprofessional, and completely lacking in basic customer service skills they were. I'm not upset about the transfer issue. If they want to enact whatever policies they want regarding transfers fine. Treating a customer the way they did today isn't.

 

Sounds like the feeling is mutual between the range and the member. Take the refund and agree to disagree.

 

makeutap, I'm not an employee of the range, but I would like to know the details. If there is a issue, I will bring it up to the right person. I've been there for years and this really surprises me. If you would PM me the details, see if we can, if nothing else, make sure no one else has that experience.

 

I'll PM you shortly @bikemancs

 

this same vague bullspit was on NCGO today...

low post member with a bitter attitude..

post what happened and give range 37 a chance to tell there side.

 

Often I find those that have problems with customer service simply got treated the way they treat others.

 

can't understand what issue one would have with a transfer. Meet up give them paperwork that is required. Pay a fee if required and go home. Maybe wait in line a bit if they are busy.

Kinda feeling like if you are going to go public with a complaint you need to go public with the complaint, not be all "cause reasons!" with the details.

 

If you read his second set of comments, it sounds like the original issue was that the range advertised free transfers for the level of membership he bought and then later changed their policy. Then the issue got exasperated by what he felt was very rude and very poor customer service when he inquired. Not sure that is correct but that is what I get from his comments above.

 

maybe he is one of those people that show up 13 seconds after the delivery notification hits the email demanding that they get his transfer done NOW!!!!

 

Is it wrong to follow the big brown truck into the lot and wait for the transfer?

 

@makeutap247 You feel you were treated poor, poor CS, feel they were wrong about a transfer or something, but won't share the details of what happened. That's vague, and you are not telling us what happened. I don't like vague negative reviews on the forum.

If your going to post a public negative review, you need to explain exactly what happened, and not only to a range member in pm since you took this public on CSC. I won't let a vague negative review remain. So what was the issue leading to this poor CS, and why was the CS poor in your opinion?

Thanks

 

how hard would it have been for him to say

"i went to get a transfer and they told me it was 20$, when i showed them that i signed up for a gold membership they told me no anyway"

 

Of course none of these comments are accurate. Didn't involve having to pay for a transfer I thought was free, didn't have to do with having to wait, etc etc. I never said it did and the transfer thing like I tried to say more times than I can count is not the problem I had. I know what happened today. I didn't relate the whole transfer thing because I didn't feel it was the problem or relevant. I know how many transfers I have done the past few years. No, I don't stay glued to this or any other forum. I have said numerous times it was the way they acted and not the transfer issue. If you want to continue to rip me then go ahead by all means. When someone else has a similar experience....oh well, your were warned. I will not be recommending them to anyone at this point.

 

A benefit of being a gold member is free transfers. I saw that as a nice added benefit, but it was not why I joined the range. Having a couple rifles coming in, I figured I would utilize it instead of using my local gun shop I normally use for transfers for $15 each. It's nice for online gun stores to already have the FFL on file when I place an order, but I have uploaded or emailed quite a few FFLs for online gun store or Gunbroker purchases. I've never had a problem having a receiver give me their FFL. Both my local gun stores will with no problem. One keeps a stack of signed file copies of their FFL near the register. Both are quite large and have been in business for years and I imagine do quite a few transfers since their FFLs are usually on file and I don't even have to worry about it when I make a purchase. I have yet to find anyone though with 37 PSRs on file.

So, I call and ask if I come by their and get a copy. The woman I spoke to on the phone says no that the ATF won't allow that and that I'll have to get the seller to contact them in order for them to send a copy of their FFL to the seller. I have bought A LOT of firearms online and I have never had to do that. Never had a problem getting a copy of an FFL. So, I tell her that and she says well that's what the ATF requires of them. I get off the phone because I didn't feel like arguing. I'm out running some errands though so I decide I'll go by there and talk to someone face to face.

When I get there the woman, who I assume was Frankie's wife since she told me later she was the owner, is there. I asked her if she could explain their transfer process to me and she asks if I'm the person who just called to which I tell her I was. She tells me basically the same thing she told me on the phone that the ATF won't allow it. I told her I had always done it and produce a copy of one of my local gun shops FFL that I picked up at the house and had in my pocket. They've been in business for years and they have no problem giving a customer their FFL. I told her I make a lot of purchases online. That's when the guy who lives on site chimes in an says why don't I get an FFL then in a super smart alec tone. Well, not that it's any of his business, but one of several reasons and the most obvious one is I am not engaged in the business of buying/selling firearms. The woman keeps telling me I'm arguing with them. I said "No, I just know that I've never had anyone tell me the ATF won't allow them to give me a copy of their FFL." She then says well that's the way it is, it's their policy and they're not changing it for me. Fine, no problem. If she had just told me that from the beginning our conversation would probably been a lot shorter. I did ask her if she would talk to her ATF agent and double check on their policy. She says no. So, I'm thinking this place that is supposed to be very shooter friendly isn't seeming so shooter friendly to me but whatever.

I then try to ask another question about delivery. I know they are only open to the public Fri-Sun so I was wondering if something was delivered there during the week if someone would be there to accept it. I was hardly able to get the question out. It was just crazy. Wish I did have the whole incident recorded. I'm trying to ask it and even start out with I've got another question and she's just like you keep arguing with us. I've moved on but her and this guy that lives there on site are just hung up on it. She tells me that I am the only one who had ever inquired about the seller having to contact them directly to get a copy of their FFL. That may be true, but as many as I have uploaded or faxed/emailed I find that hard to imagine. So somewhere along the line, the guy says you can get a refund for your membership if you don't like it. I'm just like I never said anything about getting a refund for my membership. I literally never mentioned it and didn't want one. So, I finally get my other question asked and she answers it. No problem, but they're hung up on the whole transfer thing. Some customers are coming in and the guy then says "We're open for business and have customers here and we really don't won't you here anymore." I'm like what the heck? I pay $300 for a membership and you don't want me here? I don't get it. Maybe they didn't want to be bothered with transfers, especially after I said I make quite a few purchases, but the way they acted was ridiculous.

Let me be clear, during this entire time I never used any profanity and don't think I got louder than my normal tone of voice. The comments they made I have no where done justice here. They and especially the guy were just two of the rudest people I have ever encountered in a retail environment. Honestly, I would rather continue paying for transfers than deal with them. Again though, the whole transfer thing is not my problem with 37 PSR. My problem is with the way they acted. To say they were extremely rude and unprofessional is a vast understatement. If I treated customers like that I wouldn't expect to be in business long.

 

A benefit of being a gold member is free transfers. I saw that as a nice added benefit, but it was not why I joined the range. Having a couple rifles coming in, I figured I would utilize it instead of using my local gun shop I normally use for transfers for $15 each. It's nice for online gun stores to already have the FFL on file when I place an order, but I have uploaded or emailed quite a few FFLs for online gun store or Gunbroker purchases. I've never had a problem having a receiver give me their FFL. Both my local gun stores will with no problem. One keeps a stack of signed file copies of their FFL near the register. Both are quite large and have been in business for years and I imagine do quite a few transfers since their FFLs are usually on file and I don't even have to worry about it when I make a purchase. I have yet to find anyone though with 37 PSRs on file.

So, I call and ask if I come by their and get a copy. The woman I spoke to on the phone says no that the ATF won't allow that and that I'll have to get the seller to contact them in order for them to send a copy of their FFL to the seller. I have bought A LOT of firearms online and I have never had to do that. Never had a problem getting a copy of an FFL. So, I tell her that and she says well that's what the ATF requires of them. I get off the phone because I didn't feel like arguing. I'm out running some errands though so I decide I'll go by there and talk to someone face to face.

When I get there the woman, who I assume was Frankie's wife since she told me later she was the owner, is there. I asked her if she could explain their transfer process to me and she asks if I'm the person who just called to which I tell her I was. She tells me basically the same thing she told me on the phone that the ATF won't allow it. I told her I had always done it and produce a copy of one of my local gun shops FFL that I picked up at the house and had in my pocket. They've been in business for years and they have no problem giving a customer their FFL. I told her I make a lot of purchases online. That's when the guy who lives on site chimes in an says why don't I get an FFL then in a super smart alec tone. Well, not that it's any of his business, but one of several reasons and the most obvious one is I am not engaged in the business of buying/selling firearms. The woman keeps telling me I'm arguing with them. I said "No, I just know that I've never had anyone tell me the ATF won't allow them to give me a copy of their FFL." She then says well that's the way it is, it's their policy and they're not changing it for me. Fine, no problem. If she had just told me that from the beginning our conversation would probably been a lot shorter. I did ask her if she would talk to her ATF agent and double check on their policy. She says no. So, I'm thinking this place that is supposed to be very shooter friendly isn't seeming so shooter friendly to me but whatever.

I then try to ask another question about delivery. I know they are only open to the public Fri-Sun so I was wondering if something was delivered there during the week if someone would be there to accept it. I was hardly able to get the question out. It was just crazy. Wish I did have the whole incident recorded. I'm trying to ask it and even start out with I've got another question and she's just like you keep arguing with us. I've moved on but her and this guy that lives there on site are just hung up on it. She tells me that I am the only one who had ever inquired about the seller having to contact them directly to get a copy of their FFL. That may be true, but as many as I have uploaded or faxed/emailed I find that hard to imagine. So somewhere along the line, the guy says you can get a refund for your membership if you don't like it. I'm just like I never said anything about getting a refund for my membership. I literally never mentioned it and didn't want one. So, I finally get my other question asked and she answers it. No problem, but they're hung up on the whole transfer thing. Some customers are coming in and the guy then says "We're open for business and have customers here and we really don't won't you here anymore." I'm like what the heck? I pay $300 for a membership and you don't want me here? I don't get it. Maybe they didn't want to be bothered with transfers, especially after I said I make quite a few purchases, but the way they acted was ridiculous.

Let me be clear, during this entire time I never used any profanity and don't think I got louder than my normal tone of voice. The comments they made I have no where done justice here. They and especially the guy were just two of the rudest people I have ever encountered in a retail environment. Honestly, I would rather continue paying for transfers than deal with them. Again though, the whole transfer thing is not my problem with 37 PSR. My problem is with the way they acted. To say they were extremely rude and unprofessional is a vast understatement. If I treated customers like that I wouldn't expect to be in business long.

Thanks,,thats what I was looking for. Even though they are really close Ive never been there but once just to look around to see if I wanted to use it. I drive by it every time while going to Guns Plus indoor range. I don't really care for the Guns Plus's personal or their prices but I like their range. I don't have anything good or bad to say about PSR because Ive never used them. The reason I don't use them is because they are always busy and closed to the Public during the week.

 

Nobody is ripping you, not really, but you are acting vague.

How about you start at the beginning. Explain what happened, how exactly they were rude to you, and other related events.

Details are important you know.

Edit: See wasn't that easier?

 

FFLs do not have to give you a copy of their license, and most won't under any circumstances.

All anyone needs is the numbers to look it up on the atf site.

You were beating a dead horse.

 

^^^This^^^

Don't assume because you do business with one dealer one way that you can do business with all other dealers the same. They have a right to enact their ow policies the way they choose since its their business. Based on your description of the whole event I have to say I would have probably offered you a refund for your membership too. No offense, but based on what you wrote you probably came off as being a difficult person to deal with and they probably felt you were not worth the headache to keep around moving forward. Believe it or not all customers arent good customers so its not always in the best interest of a business to try and keep all customers. Additionally, based on what you wrote and how you wrote it I have the I impression that your overall communication skills are a bit challenging for some people to deal with. I've never met you in person so I can only make that assumption based on all of your post in this thread.
Sorry to hear about your poor experience but PSR is a good shop so its not really fair for you label them having poor service when the real issue so they wouldn't conduct business the way "YOU" wanted them to. So I'm sorry things didn't work out but overall I believe it was for the best for both parties involved.

 

Thanks for finally explaining your side. You were not being ripped, we just prefer the details (being less vauge) in a negative review.


I've run into many dealers that will not provide their FFL copy to non FFL individuals. While not a rule per say that I can find, I have been told by a few dealers that ATF agents recommend to them that they not hand out their FFL copy to non FFL individuals. A few do hand them out. This is their preference of how to conduct business. I don't argue with them.

Again, Thanks for finally sharing your side, details, and opinion.

 

As others have stated, the ATF suggests that FFL's not hand out copies of their licenses. The reason for this is that some unscrupulous people/criminals have used this info to fraudulently present themselves as FFLs.

They were completely rude and unprofessional not to mention dead wrong about the issue I inquired about.

[...]

I wasn't arguing with them. I simply drove up there to talk to someone face to face about why they were telling me something that I knew was absolutely not correct.

Hopefully you can see now that it was you who was wrong, not 37 PSR.

Personally, I'd go back there, eat some humble pie/apologize, and continue to enjoy the range.

 

A few years ago, when I was doing an FFL Transfer through 37, they provided me a copy of their FFL. When I went to do one last year they did not. I asked, they said they changed their rules, I said ok, and sent them the contact information of the sending shop. the transfer went off without a hitch, and yep, didn't cost me anything.

On the other part of your complaint... If anyone has been to the range and interacted with the staff, you know there's a very unique attitude, not good, not bad, just different. It's their property, and their range. I have never had problems there. Good luck and hope to catch you out there sometime.

 

.

 

That's what I was reading as well.

I had a similar experience (the difference being the employee was nice the whole time) with a C3 dealer that said he couldn't mail be a suppressor unless I was a C3 dealer. I told him there's a big difference in "can't" and "won't". Just be honest...don't blame a store policy on an ATF statute that doesn't exist.

I had a similar experience at Wally World. It was after 9pm (actually 915 pm) and the sporting goods counter was unmanned. Had them call someone to get some 9mm, as I was shooting the next morning and 9mm was hard to get at that time. They had 3 100 round boxes. The guy from electronics came over and proceeded to tell me that it was against "State Law" to sell ammo after 9 pm. I told him that it wasn't and he starts quoting said law. I ask if it was store policy and he keeps quoting this law. Tells me to come back tomorrow. I come back that next morning and of course, it was gone and I was pissed! I raised hell (politely ) to the Sporting goods manager and he said it was store policy but the night management could and would sell it to customers after 9. People that don't know what they are talking about shouldn't be there telling things that they make up as they go along!

 

I've had issues with a store or two where it was quite plain that what they were saying was downright wrong/false. And when I asked for an explanation, I was fed a line of false BS that was either a lie, a huge conceptual error, or simple policy that they're not willing to simply state as such. If something is policy, just frickin' say so, don't try to butter it up as something it's not. I respect both honesty and the right of private businesses to set whatever policies they wish.

I don't argue. I just take several hundred dollars worth of immediate purchases to a competitor and perhaps several thousand dollars of potential future purchases as well.

I don't have the time or inclination to debate stupidity with people. And I'm definately not going to get into an argument over firearms in a store.

(The last time was a sporting goods store in VA that wouldn't sell me a long gun because I wasn't a VA or NC resident because it was "against the law". Wrong. It was store/company policy. I left and bought my rifle elsewhere less than an hour later. Then called the store back and explained to the manager how his store just lost a thousand dollars in sales. No muss, no fuss.)

 

its their Policy not the BATFs...so if they said BATF dont allow , thats BS,

.My experience over the years is they give me a copy and i mail with payment and the purchase goes back to the store NOT me....no problem.

.i dont have a dog in the fight, but they can, just dont have to

 

its their Policy not the BATFs...so if they said BATF dont allow , thats BS,

.My experience over the years is they give me a copy and i mail with payment and the purchase goes back to the store NOT me....no problem.

.i dont have a dog in the fight, but they can, just dont have to

I also don't have a dog in the fight, but there can be a slight miss use in the words. BATF agents have in fact advised many FFL dealers not to hand out their copies. I can see how that can get changed to employees assuming they (the BATF), don't allow, when this info is passed down from employer to employees, just telling them the BATF said not to hand out any FFL copies anymore. It certainly would be more proper to say the BATF has advised us not to hand out FFL copies, but the employees following orders likely didn't know exactly where it came from, and that it was an advisement not a BATF rule change. I just don't see the big deal or point in arguing over it with the dealer. I've done all my transfers smoothly without ever having a copy. All you have to do is give the dealer fax # or email address to the other dealer, it's actually easier, they take care of everything for you that way, and you don't have to send anything.

Some people just need to step back a minute before saying it's all BS, making it seem that the person working for the dealer is intentionally lying / misleading.

 

I dunno, they sound like dicks to me, regardless of policy.

 

You need to understand that the ATF sees a lot at local FFL's. This knowledge is shared.

I had the local ATF guy (same one for PSR) tell me the same-thing because a different retail store started to have guns just showing up on the door step with no customer info or data. then this store was stuck with holding firearms for MONTHS without knowing anything. Then one day a customer back from deployment walked in to transfer his 13 firearms.

how did this Soldier do this? The shop gave him a copy of the FFL and he took it with him ND BURNED up Gun broker! LOL

Now the local ATF guy shared this info with many other shops as a example of why not to just hand out a copy of the FFL. you will have firearms just show up with no framework of who it is for.

I was of the mindset of yeah right no biggie. Two months ago I had 2 items show up on form 3's and guess what?? I have no idea who they go to. And yes I called the dealer who sent them out of state and they will not tell me who bought the product.

That store policy is not a bad one.

John

 

Thanks for the insight, John.